GUNS IN SCHOOLS

[thecleaninglady]

I just received information that on Friday
September 29,2006 a person brought a
gun to the high school dance in Phoenix.

I have been told that Channel 3 was there
at the high school today so I am going to watch.

There is so much being said about the teachers
and how much they are paid but I would like to
see more about what the schools are going to
do to make it safe for our children to be there.

If we don't send our children, we can get in trouble
and have them taken away from us.
If we do, we may have them taken away by a killer.
What a freaking choice!

I don't blame the schools as it is not them
with the guns. But I do think they need to
start taking this more seriously than they
have to this point.

PARENTS:
KEEP YOUR GUNS LOCKED UP
OR GET RID OF THEM.

CHECK THE BACKPACK(S) AND BAGS OF
YOUR CHILD(REN) BEFORE THEY LEAVE
YOUR HOUSE EVERY DAY.

NEVER MIND HOW OLD THEY ARE
OR HOW MUCH TROUBLE
THEY GIVE YOU ON THIS, DO IT!!!

AND DON'T SAY "MY CHILD WOULDN'T DO THAT"
BECAUSE THEY MIGHT.

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[fromtheweb]

Phoenix (WSYR-TV) - The Phoenix Police Department and School District are both investigating reports that a BOCES student brought a gun to the Phoenix High School homecoming dance on Friday night. The BOCES student is in custody.

According to the Phoenix Police Department, an officer assigned to the high school dance was called to the Assistant Principal’s Office on Friday night to check out a report that an 18-year-old BOCES student brought a pocket knife and marijuana to the school. The student was arrested for unlicensed possession of marijuana, and sent home.

After the dance, parents called police to tell them that they heard that the student had a gun prior to entering the office. The parents also said that they heard that the student gave the gun to someone else prior to entering the office.

No gun has been found. Police and school officials continue to search parts of the school property.

Phoenix Police say they have two officers and the department’s chief on the investigation.

A letter has been sent home to parents in the Phoenix School District, alerting them of the investigation and arrest. In the letter, the district says it is doing everything it can to ensure students’ safety.

The student will not be allowed onto school property until the investigation is completed, according to the letter

[NONAMUSH]

JUST ANOTHER GUN TOTING REDNECK.PROLLY INBRED TO.WHEN IS IT GONNA HAPPEN HERE.CITY IS FULL OF REDNECKS AND RAP GANSTAS.

[NOT A REDNECK]

They have only rumors of a gun being at the school. When kids tell stories they have a tendecy to add a little drama into what they have heard, not unlike some adults.
Is it necessary to call people rednecks because they live outside of the Metropolis of Oswego? Maybe you ment all people who own a gun are rednecks. Whichever it is you ruined a good post by becoming bigoted and injurious toward a whole community because of one persons actions.

[aguest]

what? so rap gangster is ok?

[radneck]

crass.on.ru/flash/aaa-1.html

[thecleaninglady]

Police have made two arrests after a week-long investigation into a gun incident during a home coming dance at Phoenix High School. According to Phoenix Chief of Police, Rod Carr, 18 year old Travis Oja of State Route 49 in Fulton has been charged with Criminal Possession of a Weapon in the 4th Degree, Criminal Nuisance, and Disorderly Conduct. Oja also faces charges of Unlawful Possession of Marijuana which he was carrying when he was arrested at the dance.

Chief Carr also says a 14 year old freshman student at the High School will be charged in Oswego County Family Court as a juvenile for lying to the police. If he were being charged as an adult over the age of 16,the charges would be considered similar to Filing a False Written Statement and Obstructing Governmental Administration.

According to witnesses, Oja told another boy to stay away from his girlfriend and showed several students he was carrying a gun. No weapon was found, but the fact that witnesses say they saw it resulted in the weapons possession charge.

More than 25 people were interviewed in connection with the incident and more interviews are still being conducted.

[truthbetold]

Yes, It's true. Some one did bring a gun to the high school. My brother teaches there and confimed it for me. There has been to much violence at that high school over the last year; this consists mainly of fighting in the cafeteria among students. It's prettty frightening when you hear things like this in a small town, unfortunately we never know who or what is around
us. None of us are ever really safe. The world is going crazy and the children are as stressed out as their parents/adults. It's a fast world, and that goes for our children too. We need to educate and prepare the students for life out of school. If possible show them some of the real world where people live in fear all the time. Be truthful and compassionate and caring when or if you chose to sit down with your beautiful child. I believe people are basically good and we all need to look out for our neighbors.

[666]

The weapons charge is from the kid having a knife. The gun was not found so the charge could never stick. Some kids have said he did not have a gun, others said he had a BB gun, some others said it was a semi auto, who is telling the truth and who is dramatizing the event. He said she said with a bunch of kids (and ADULTS) never gets the truth out, just rumors.
Phoenix HS is no different than any other HS around here with kids acting like fools at times.
How many kids drive cars and trucks to schools across the county and have guns in them?
About the kids in Phoenix fighting, it happens in every school and has for a long time. Kids have always fought at school and always will.
What do you people want to do pass some more laws to make yourselves feel safer? You all like to blow everything out of proportion and add drama to the stories.
Working on a police state?

[thecleaninglady]

No one wants a "police state", just better
parenting and more common sense instilled
into the youths of today.

They are our future and we need to help
them become productive adults.

I have raised many children, mine and
those of others, and have never had
a situation where any of them took
anything to school that they shouldn't.

It isn't just the weapons and drugs in
schools that we need to correct. This
past summer I took 5 kids to Sriba Town
pool and there was a kid there about 6
calling someone a f*cker. Recently outside of
an elementary school I heard a child about
9 call a girl a sl*t person.

[666]

You are 100% right about the parenting. Too many people have children and expect them to raise themselves while mom and dad just do their own thing. Too many kids having kids, kids who are not mature enough to take care of themselves having babies that they can't afford to care for. Uneducated kids and adults having sex and not caring about what the out come may be.
There should be a required IQ for anyone who is planning on having children.

[truthbetold]

the weapon was a BB gun.

[Truth]

thecleaninglady said:

...snipped...
It isn't just the weapons and drugs in schools that we need to correct. This past summer I took 5 kids to Sriba Town pool and there was a kid there about 6 calling someone a f*cker. Recently outside of an elementary school I heard a child about 9 call a girl a sl*t person.

(off topic)

Some parents use those words liberally around their small children. So be it, its their children. I don't find it appropriate what so ever, but that's me. What those parents might not see is that they are indirectly telling their kids to talk the same way. So, those foul mouthed kids more than likely have foulmouthed parents.

The apple doesn't fall far from the tree.

[thecleaninglady]

www.cpsc.gov/cpscpub/pubs/5089.html

Many people do not realize that BB guns,
especially high-velocity guns, can cause death.

So, even if it was a BB gun, the chance of
serious injury or death was there.

[666]

No one questions if a bb gun can cause harm. It is the statements that are trying to make it look like the kid was armed for combat that just add to all the hype. NO GUN has been recovered, so until it is, it is still hearsay and rumors. The kid had some weed and a pocket knife and thats what he should be chrged with, plain and simple. If they recover a gun then change the charges to fit that crime.
FYI, the vast majority of standard BB pistols have a velocity of about 400 fps, not going to kill you unless the shooter gets a one in a million shot, and thats being conservative.
You keep adding more dramatics to make a point that is mute.

[thecleaninglady]

BB guns can kill a person. High-velocity BB guns,
which have muzzle velocities higher than 350
feet per second, can increase this risk.

No dramatics, just a fact.
You are correct that the weapon has not been found.
Yet.

(and it is "moot" not mute )

[666]

I don't want to argue about bb guns but a high velocity gun is considered one which can fire a bb or pellet at 1000 fps or higher, not 350 fps. 4 deaths a year and all are from pellet rifles not bb pistols. You are bringing dramatics into it by making it sound like the bb gun was a HANDGUN and the kid was going to shot up the place. This is what causes all the rumors and BS that gets everyone in an uproar. Its bad enough that the TV news and papers have used the power of editing to scare people and boost their ratings.
About the spelling, do you have a badge that says spelling police or are you a spelling vigilante?
DRAMA thats what you all want, if its not in the truth you all edit and add your own. FACT

[Truth]

Question: If someone robs a bank with a concealed squirtgun, aren't they treated the same as if it was a real gun?

If the people around him thought he had a real gun, it could have gotten real ugly if others had guns, which is something we don't know. Not likely, but possible. Who knows what others had in their cars as well.

Say you are a policeman and you are up against a person with a gun. You have no idea what kind of gun it is. It might be a stick, but you don't know. How do you approach the situation?

[666]

The point was that there has been NO gun found and the kid was not looking start another Columbine massacre.
I'm not in any way saying what the kid did was OK. The stories that are being circulated around are full of hearsay and rumors and distort what really happened. The kid is a fool and should be delt with accordingly.
To answer your last question, if a person points anything that can be mistaken for a weapon at another person or a cop then thats their mistake and if they get shot or whatever so be it.
People have made this story out to be much more than it was. Everyone likes the dramatic spins that are added to hype up the story and make it more sensational.

[Truth]

OK, the kid had no gun.

But people are a little on the reactive side these days. There have been many shooting in the country as of late and they don't want to take chances. This is no excuse for mass hysteria created by hype but it is understandable why the concern is so high.

This looks like another fine example of the small community rumor mill churning out information that is more exciting than factual. Funny how easy it is to get people riled up. Ah, life in a sleepy little town.

[thecleaninglady]

666 said:

I don't want to argue about bb guns but a high velocity gun is considered one which can fire a bb or pellet at 1000 fps or higher, not 350 fps. 4 deaths a year and all are from pellet rifles not bb pistols. You are bringing dramatics into it by making it sound like the bb gun was a HANDGUN and the kid was going to shot up the place. This is what causes all the rumors and BS that gets everyone in an uproar. Its bad enough that the TV news and papers have used the power of editing to scare people and boost their ratings.
About the spelling, do you have a badge that says spelling police or are you a spelling vigilante?
DRAMA thats what you all want, if its not in the truth you all edit and add your own. FACT

I don't know what you are reading BUT
according to :
www.cpsc.gov/cpscpub/pubs/5089.html

The U.S. Consumer Product Safety Commission has reports of about 4 deaths per year caused by BB guns or pellet rifles.

www.adventuresinairguns.com/BBgunsafety.html
says:
The high velocity BB guns of more than 350 feet per second significantly increase the risk of injury or death, and it is not recommended that children under 16 years of age operate this type of gun.

(And I said nothing about your spelling...
you used the wrong word...)

[666]

You are stuck on the High Velocity thing. If thats the knowledge you have of a bb or pellet gun (I know the sites very well) then I'm wasting both our time. FYO, high velocity (at least 750 FPS in a .22 cal, or 900 FPS in a .177 cal). Low velocity (.177 or .22 round pellets at muzzle velocities of 200 to 700 fps. Considered of low energy and relatively "safe" for children)
Here we are again, someone trying to make a bb gun sound like a 357 magnum. Lady you are one of the ones who hypes up the stories and causes all the hysteria. Stop acting like a Drama Queen. You do more harm than good.

[thecleaninglady]

For one, I never said the person had a gun.
I said I received info that a person brought
the gun to the dance.

Next, I checked into the bb gun thing after
it was put on here that the weapon was a bb gun.
I have never had one or been around one so
I wanted some info. I gave the links where I
found the info. I was not trying to hype up
anything. I was quoting info from 2 web sites
about bb guns, not about what was/wasn't
brought to the dance. If people get "hysterical"
over that information then they need help.

Your take on high velocity is different from
the 2 sites I mentioned. I would like to see
where you are getting your information from.

[666]

www.airgundepot.com/popular-pellet-guns.html
www.airgun.co.uk/airgun_ballistics3.htm
The first site is a dealer, the other is about the ballistics of airguns.
The majority of my information comes from using High velocity airguns for target and sport for better than 25 years. I own and have owned many different airguns from low velocity to high velocity compitition pistols and rifles.
You say that you are not trying to hype up a story, then why would you write about such a low number of deaths caused by airguns like it is a common accurance. The bb gun was not some kind of WMD and the kid was not a Columbine psycho. Why would you even look to see how many deaths are caused by airguns?
You also wrote about parents checking their kids when they leave the house, and seeing what they have in their backpaks etc. One kid does something foolish and you want to frisk the kids before they walk out the door, whats next metal detectors at the front door? You don't even see that you turn and spin everything into a drama. Did you ever hear of teaching and trust? You don't treat all kids like criminals because of one persons actions.

"No weapon was found, but the fact that witnesses say they saw it resulted in the weapons possession charge." Your post, and a half truth. The weapons charge was from him being in possesion of a pocket knife, nothing to do with the gun. How about looking to see how many deaths are caused by kids bring pocket knives to school, then you can call for parents to take away pocket knives and nail clippers from their kids.

You want to start something how about going after the media for over reporting on school shootings to the point that it bring out the freaks who want their name in print, so they do copy cat crimes.

[666]

TODAY:
Columbine copycat student in US school shooting scare

A MASKED teenager fired an assault rifle at the ceiling in school before the weapon jammed.

Police were called to the building in Joplin, Missouri, and arrested the youth.

They found a note in his bag in which he had made detailed plans on placing an explosive in the school.

Lieutenant Geoff Jones said the youth had been fascinated with the Columbine massacre.

Witnesses said the boy walked into school, yesterday, wearing a long green trenchcoat and had a T-shirt over his head with eye holes cut out.

He told staff at the Joplin Memorial Middle School: "Please don't make me do this."

They tried to talk him into putting the gun down, but he refused and fired a shot into the ceiling of an entryway.

He tried to continue firing but the rifle jammed and the youngster left.

Officers arrested the teen behind a nearby building. Police described his weapon as a Mac-90 assault rifle belonging to the boy's parents. Officer Curt Farmer said it is not uncommon for people in the area to own assault weapons.

Superintendent Jim Simpson said police told him the boy was fascinated with the Columbine High shooting that left 15 people dead in Colorado in 1999.

How do you stop it from happening again?

If we want to address this agonizing problem, perhaps we should pay some attention to what the children are telling us. We need “kinder, gentler” schools. We cannot continue to allow bullying and abuse as normal milestones of child development. We need to communicate the value of caring, and demonstrate that care. We need to provide alternatives to violence for problem-solving, to encourage more frequent, open, and genuine communication between students and the adults who care for them, at home, at school, in the community.
Students say revenge is clearly the major reason for school shootings.

[thecleaninglady]

666 said:

TODAY:
(...snipped...)
Officers arrested the teen behind a nearby building. Police described his weapon as a Mac-90 assault rifle belonging to the boy's parents. Officer Curt Farmer said it is not uncommon for people in the area to own assault weapons.

What isn't in this post is this from CNN:
Jones said the gun belonged to the boy's parents, who kept the weapon in a safe at home. The parents told police their son apparently knew the combination to the gun safe.

Well,duh!
But they still should have known where
the weapon was.

You also said in another post :
"No weapon was found, but the fact that witnesses say they saw it resulted in the weapons possession charge." Your post, and a half truth.

I got that from Channel 3 News site.

As far as the number of deaths...4 may be low to
you but it is too many to the families involved.
Again, a parenting issue. I didn't know anything
about these bb guns/pellet guns so I searched
for information. Not on how many deaths they
cause(d) but to get at least a little info on them.

I totally agree with the last part of your post.
(Reply #24)

[666]

Not looking to down play any death but accidents happen and people die, its part of the life cycle. More people choke on their dinner and die than get killed with a bb gun. I do understand your views, I just believe that the incidect at Phoenix HS is being blown way out of proportion.
Some are now calling for teachers to carry guns in school.
The thing that most of these kids seem to have in common is that they are isolated, angry, and alone. They feel like outsiders in their school, and they take out those feelings in violent ways. Adding armed teachers into the mix would only serve to make the perceived isolation and anger even more intense.
"The point here is that young people don't just turn up at school and start pulling the trigger," said Ronald Stephens, executive director of the National School Safety Center, a Los Angeles area advocacy group. "It's important that school officials learn to recognize the warning signals."

The solution, Stephens said, is not "to turn schools into armed camps" but to "make them more welcoming" and encourage "a much closer partnership between teachers, local law enforcement and mental health professionals."

Parents need to be more responsible for their kids.

Teachers need to teach and have no business in the law enforcement of the schools. Half of them can't even teach, why would anyone want to give them guns.

Putting "real security" or police in the schools would be more reasonable.

[truthbetold]

The fact of the matter is there was a bb gun at the school , my brother teaches there. I believe whether it was a bb gun or any other (according to some) real or toy weapon the child having the gun is not in the right state of mind.
Sorry, but bb guns can kill. When I was a kid, one of the neighborhood kids was killed by one.
You can't convince me this child didn't know what he was doing. Weapons in general are becoming too common place in schools.

[new user]

With everything in the news about school shootings, why would a kid who should know better even bring a weapon? It is like a death wish or something,,,,he would get blown away if the cops thought it was a real gun. I think he wanted attention.